Searching for particular types of weaves using chainmaille jargon?

[ashemdragon12]

Hello everyone! I just got on this forum so I hope this isn't, like, some obnoxious newbie question that actually gets asked and answered constantly.

So, I am not very new to chainmaille itself but I am fairly new to, I guess... The academic (for lack of better word) side of it. I've mostly just done European or Japanese sheets, or some byzantine chains. Only recently have I really started being more interested in making more ornate jewelry-type stuff (as opposed to just a big piece of armor) and I'm so lost by all the terminology used in the "filter" functions of like the M.A.I.L. weaves collection, or Maillepedia on here? Like out of all the filter categories on the Maillepedia here, the "Weave Families" is the only one that makes any sense to me, but even then I really can't visualize the particulars of why stuff like Trizantine or Ravensara would be in the "European" family, for example.

So I was just wondering if there's any sorts of resources that kinda go into the explanations of all this terminology and exactly what qualities of weaves they describe? I have a few projects in mind that I have sort of a vision for but I could only really describe the qualities I'm looking for in plain English, so I'd really like to learn the vocabulary I need to hunt down particular sorts of weaves on my own.

Thanks for any help! ^-^

 

[chainmaillers.com]

Hello everyone! I just got on this forum so I hope this isn't, like, some obnoxious newbie question that actually gets asked and answered constantly.

Welcome to the site! Not obnoxious or newbie at all.

I'm so lost by all the terminology used in the "filter" functions of like the M.A.I.L. weaves collection, or Maillepedia on here? Like out of all the filter categories on the Maillepedia here, the "Weave Families" is the only one that makes any sense to me, but even then I really can't visualize the particulars of why stuff like Trizantine or Ravensara would be in the "European" family, for example.

That's the million dollar question, lol

There's, that I know of, 3 major classification systems in use currently.

• MAIL uses the MAIL system. Maillepedia filter system includes: weave families, weave types, weave characteristics, and weave elements.
  • https://www.mailleartisans.org/articles/articledisplay.php?key=778
  • https://www.mailleartisans.org/articles/articledisplay.php?key=760
• Tome of Weaves uses the R.I.M. (Ring Interaction Model) system. (not available in the Maillepedia filter system)
  • https://www.mailleartisans.org/articles/articledisplay.php?key=639
• Chainmaillers, and by extension, the Maillepedia, started with the MAIL system, added information from the R.I.M. system for some entries, and has slowly been transitioning to our own system CCT (Cellular Chainmaille Theory). Maillepedia filter system includes: cell types, weave class, transformation types, and variant types.

In other words, things can be confusing, it's not just you CCT is currently a work in progress which is why I haven't published anything major regarding it yet. Many of the concepts are the same as MAIL, but may be called by different names and/or have different definitions. Newer entries in the Maillepedia may not have any of the categorizations present in the MAIL entries as a result of transitioning, but due to CCT still being a work in progress, older entries may not have any of the CCT categorizations. I know, clear as mud, sorry

So I was just wondering if there's any sorts of resources that kinda go into the explanations of all this terminology and exactly what qualities of weaves they describe? I have a few projects in mind that I have sort of a vision for but I could only really describe the qualities I'm looking for in plain English, so I'd really like to learn the vocabulary I need to hunt down particular sorts of weaves on my own.

The links above should help with explanations regarding the MAIL and R.I.M. systems. As far as I know, they are the only information published on them.

In regards to CCT, and the Maillepedia filter system, feel free to ask your questions about the choices in the filter and I will answer.

 

[ashemdragon12]

Hooooly crap just that second link to M.A.I.L. helped so much just by explaining the TTE, ATE, RoR, and orbital/captive stuff, and the table of terminology at the bottom of the page.
R.I.M. sounds interesting but tragically the link to Josh's actual diagram seems to be dead T^T
I managed to find this image included in an interview with the guy where the R.I.M. is mentioned; does it seem like the original? Whether it is or not, it's a little too low-res to be very readable...

Anyways, I think for now that honestly explains about as much as I need to know about the Maillepedia filters for now... One of the projects I had in mind was like, an open bracelet (like the kind that's rigid like a bangle but it doesn't make a full circle, so you slip it on over your wrist rather than over your hand, if that makes sense?), and I was hoping one of these jargony words would help me maybe find a chain that will be rigid (which I guess depends on AR more than anything else) and that could also curve rather than going straight?

If I may let my ADHD win for a moment and start rambling about possible ways to achieve that: I think I could probably just cause something to curve by using bigger rings on the outside of the curve and smaller rings on the inside, and then I just have to find a chain whose geometry allows for a consistent "inside" and "outside" of the curve... OR, I could go ahead with a little bit looser of a weave but run a wire through the middle of it to help it maintain structure, or use something that's juuuust loose enough that it doesn't become rigid until it's bent to a certain point, and then add some rubber rings to keep the tension on the inside of the curve to keep it rigid; and using rubber rings on the inside would also offer the benefit of a little extra padding and maybe some extra friction to prevent the bracelet from flying off (since the friend that this bracelet would be for always wears that open kind of bracelet and always has issues with them flying off his wrist XD), assuming they can actually generate enough tension to keep the bracelet rigid.

 

[chainmaillers.com]

Hooooly crap just that second link to M.A.I.L. helped so much just by explaining the TTE, ATE, RoR, and orbital/captive stuff, and the table of terminology at the bottom of the page.

Glad it helped

R.I.M. sounds interesting but tragically the link to Josh's actual diagram seems to be dead T^T

I'm not sure if articles were able to be edited by the authors on MAIL. I know that there's no current way of editing anything there since most of the functionality is broken. Here's a link to, I think, the most up to date version of the R.I.M. chart:

R.I.M.

Sheet1 1,The One Ring Level 1 1 Ring Combinations ,TOR AR > 0 1,Straight Level 2 2 Ring Combinations ,Straight AR > 1 3,Mobius,Straight,Orbital Level 3 3 Ring Combinations ,Mobius 3 AR > 1 + 2√3/3 ,Straight 3 AR > 2 ,Orbital AR > 2+2√3 20,Axiom,Mobius,Unbalanced Loop,Balanced Loop,Japanese...

docs.google.com

One of the projects I had in mind was like, an open bracelet (like the kind that's rigid like a bangle but it doesn't make a full circle, so you slip it on over your wrist rather than over your hand, if that makes sense?), and I was hoping one of these jargony words would help me maybe find a chain that will be rigid (which I guess depends on AR more than anything else) and that could also curve rather than going straight?

I think the term for a necklace like you describe is called a "Torque" and for a bracelet, it's called an "Open Bangle". That would not be able to be filterable as it's not really a weave type or form,

If I may let my ADHD win for a moment and start rambling about possible ways to achieve that: I think I could probably just cause something to curve by using bigger rings on the outside of the curve and smaller rings on the inside, and then I just have to find a chain whose geometry allows for a consistent "inside" and "outside" of the curve... OR, I could go ahead with a little bit looser of a weave but run a wire through the middle of it to help it maintain structure, or use something that's juuuust loose enough that it doesn't become rigid until it's bent to a certain point, and then add some rubber rings to keep the tension on the inside of the curve to keep it rigid; and using rubber rings on the inside would also offer the benefit of a little extra padding and maybe some extra friction to prevent the bracelet from flying off (since the friend that this bracelet would be for always wears that open kind of bracelet and always has issues with them flying off his wrist XD), assuming they can actually generate enough tension to keep the bracelet rigid.

Each of these are potential ways to make a Torque or Open Bangle out of a weave. The work part is figuring out the appropriate AR to generate the curvature required while retaining stability.